[Slowgeneral]

I have a 2020 G4 with 30% gear reduction in portals. Running a SLP high load clutch kit with 33" tires. I ran all summer long with minimal belt issues now that its winter and I'm starting to use high range im blowing belts like crazy. If I keep it in high and under 7k rpm I have no issues, belt box doesn't get hot. But I spin a few burroties at wot and clutches get hot fast. Is there anyone with stock clutches running big tires doing aggressive high speed riding without running into a ton of belt issues? Im at the point now of ditching the boss driven and going to team tied with 52 helix. Any input would be appreciated.

 

[Corbo1962]

I think that anytime you run at top speed for an extended amount of time, the clutched are going to get hot and there just isn't enough air flow to dissipate the heat. Maybe get a razorback temp gauge and monitor your temp, that way you'll know when you need to back off. Also maybe look into ways of increasing your air flow through the clutch box.

 

[Hunterworks]

I have a 2020 G4 with 30% gear reduction in portals. Running a SLP high load clutch kit with 33" tires. I ran all summer long with minimal belt issues now that its winter and I'm starting to use high range im blowing belts like crazy. If I keep it in high and under 7k rpm I have no issues, belt box doesn't get hot. But I spin a few burroties at wot and clutches get hot fast. Is there anyone with stock clutches running big tires doing aggressive high speed riding without running into a ton of belt issues? Im at the point now of ditching the boss driven and going to team tied with 52 helix. Any input would be appreciated.

The issue is your clutch kit, it must be set up for really smaller than stock tires meaning a heavier set up because you took all the load off the clutch with the reduction and having 30% with 33" is like having say 26" tires on it, so add some weight to the flyweights. We ususally suggest stock clutching in situation or set your kit up for stock tires and see.

Todd

I think that anytime you run at top speed for an extended amount of time, the clutched are going to get hot and there just isn't enough air flow to dissipate the heat. Maybe get a razorback temp gauge and monitor your temp, that way you'll know when you need to back off. Also maybe look into ways of increasing your air flow through the clutch box.

This is just the opposite, at high speed is when you have the most air flow.

 

[Slowgeneral]

I have since installed a razr back temp gauge and got the hunterworks spacer for the primary. Half my issue was the primary closing too far and causing the belt to come out of the primary too far and way too lo in the secondary.
Put a team tied secondary in it. 52 straight helix.
Primary im running all the weights in the primary and the weighted tip. Ive got it set up for maximum belt grip not really highest performance.
Not im not exploding belts like I was, but its still not able to run at higher speeds done the trail without getting hot. If im riding pretty aggressive in the 3/4 to full throttle in high my belt will continuously got hot. I slow down at 190* And let it cool down.
The trails are snow covered, so it does take much more power to go through it than a normal trail, I guess similar to soft sand?
Tire/wheel combo is 64lbs, that and the weight of the machine im guessing is just too much for the clutches?
Im going to take my tires off and put some 32" pro aurmor dual threat one. They are about 8lbs per Tire lighter.

 

[Slowgeneral]

My gearing is lower than stock with my set up now yes, however I've also more than doubled the rotating mass weight.
So far the only thing that really makes since is the rotating mass weight and machine weight along with the soft snowwy trails is just too much for the clutches and no amount of clutch tuning will 100% keep my clutches from slipping in these conditions?
I would like to do some testing on the road but the state troopers already pulled me over doing that.. so I'm kinda limited to the trails.

 

[Corbo1962]

The issue is your clutch kit, it must be set up for really smaller than stock tires meaning a heavier set up because you took all the load off the clutch with the reduction and having 30% with 33" is like having say 26" tires on it, so add some weight to the flyweights. We ususally suggest stock clutching in situation or set your kit up for stock tires and see.

Todd



This is just the opposite, at high speed is when you have the most air flow.

Yes, I understand that, but don't you get high amounts of friction and heat to the belt at max speed. I've understood and could be wrong, that when you're at that point the heat builds faster than the air flow can cool. I've seen some test on belt longevity that were purposely meant to blow a belt and the way they did it was at max speed till the belt blew. They had a belt temp gauge and at top speed the belt just kept getting hotter and hotter till it failed. Todd, tell me, is this wrong?

 

[Hunterworks]

Yes, I understand that, but don't you get high amounts of friction and heat to the belt at max speed. I've understood and could be wrong, that when you're at that point the heat builds faster than the air flow can cool. I've seen some test on belt longevity that were purposely meant to blow a belt and the way they did it was at max speed till the belt blew. They had a belt temp gauge and at top speed the belt just kept getting hotter and hotter till it failed. Todd, tell me, is this wrong?

You didn't say what vehicle, you should check our videos about blowing belts at high speed, the issue was overtravel, have a good clutch set up and no overtravel and good alignment then temps won't get high at all, mine does not get over 205 at 85mph

 

[Slowgeneral]

Ita a general 4. Fully cabed, glass windshield.
I've seen all the videos, im not a clutch guro but I do understand how they work. I've been through every possible cause.

 

[Slowgeneral]

Spoke with the local mechanic about this, he's built several generals like mine. Basicly told me what I have been thinking, im maxing out the capabilities of the clutch. The only way to off-balance heavier bigger tires is with gear reduction. A duraclutch will be a band aid for the heavier tires without re gearing.
Currently have 33" system 3 xt310 about 64lbs per tire/wheel combo. Taking them off and putting some 32" pro armor duel threats on, almost 10lbs lighter per tire. Once I get them mounted up I'll see how much difference it makes.
I need to weigh my rig too, im sure im pushing 2500lbs

 

[Hunterworks]

Spoke with the local mechanic about this, he's built several generals like mine. Basicly told me what I have been thinking, im maxing out the capabilities of the clutch. The only way to off-balance heavier bigger tires is with gear reduction. A duraclutch will be a band aid for the heavier tires without re gearing.
Currently have 33" system 3 xt310 about 64lbs per tire/wheel combo. Taking them off and putting some 32" pro armor duel threats on, almost 10lbs lighter per tire. Once I get them mounted up I'll see how much difference it makes.
I need to weigh my rig too, im sure im pushing 2500lbs

You said in first post you already had 30% and now you are saying you need it, my answers were based on you already having it.

Which is it?

Todd

 

[Slowgeneral]

You said in first post you already had 30% and now you are saying you need it, my answers were based on you already having it.

Which is it?

Todd

Have 30% reduction in portals.
What i ment was with my tire wheel set up if have to re gear the transmission lower to be able to run in high range at fast speeds without belt slipping issues.

 

[Hunterworks]

Have 30% reduction in portals.
What i ment was with my tire wheel set up if have to re gear the transmission lower to be able to run in high range at fast speeds without belt slipping issues.

I still think it is your clutch kit, gearing being off is not gonna cause belt slipping at higher speeds.

 

[Slowgeneral]

If the gearing is too tall for the weight of my tires my clutch wouldn't be able to handle the load correct? If ya think a clutch kit or clutches would make my machine not slip a belt with my set up I'll try it.
I've talked to dura clutch and unfortunately they don't sell just a primary. I've already bought a team tied secondary, It's got about 40 miles on it.
And like I said before in low range I have absolutely no issues. No matter how hard I try I can't get above 140* in low. And in high range there's no issues under about 7k rpm.
But no matter what surface I'm on anything above 7k rpm and belt temp keeps rising until I let off the throttle.

 

[Hunterworks]

If the gearing is too tall for the weight of my tires my clutch wouldn't be able to handle the load correct? If ya think a clutch kit or clutches would make my machine not slip a belt with my set up I'll try it.
I've talked to dura clutch and unfortunately they don't sell just a primary. I've already bought a team tied secondary, It's got about 40 miles on it.
And like I said before in low range I have absolutely no issues. No matter how hard I try I can't get above 140* in low. And in high range there's no issues under about 7k rpm.
But no matter what surface I'm on anything above 7k rpm and belt temp keeps rising until I let off the throttle.

Not sure you picking up what I am putting down, NO KIT AT ALL, try that. Your gearing is NOT too tall, might actually be more gearing than you need for 33 but certainly not too tall.

Also, what belt you runing exactly? That might have a bearing on temp in a general, if a XP 1000 belt then it will overtravel so you need our std washer in the primary

 

[Slowgeneral]

I understand what your saying🤦‍♂️
5 months ago when I first got portals I asked the dealership where I got them if I should go back to stock clutching bacuse I was gearing my machine lower than stock. They said no and a clutch kit would do nothing but help me.
Understand my frustration when I talk to 5 different techs about my clutch I get 5 completely different answers. So anyway moving forward, I put my primary back to stock went for a quick ride. Not enough to give definitive results but my belt temp are still rising got to 190 and ran out of time. Seems like it doesn't built heat as fast?
For the sake of doing everything I'll put my secondary clutch back on with stock spring and helix. And do some more testing, might be a few days.
I'm running the oem belt, with your white spacer in primary.
I have the alignment tool and have checked it. The alignment is perfect.
I do have a hunterworks belt I'll throw on at some point and see if it makes a difference, I've had it one before and didn't see any temp difference.

 

[Corbo1962]

I can understand your frustration. I'm not sure how much stock I would put in anything that is said from dealership techs. Your best interests and theirs don't always align. Looks like you heading down the right path though, keep us posted on what you find and good luck,

 

[Johnny 7]

Like computers and smart phones, things are great when they are working as they should, but when they act up, you just want to throw your hands in the air and surrender.
Good luck in your search for the right answer and keep us posted!

 

[Hunterworks]

I understand what your saying🤦‍♂️
5 months ago when I first got portals I asked the dealership where I got them if I should go back to stock clutching bacuse I was gearing my machine lower than stock. They said no and a clutch kit would do nothing but help me.
Understand my frustration when I talk to 5 different techs about my clutch I get 5 completely different answers. So anyway moving forward, I put my primary back to stock went for a quick ride. Not enough to give definitive results but my belt temp are still rising got to 190 and ran out of time. Seems like it doesn't built heat as fast?
For the sake of doing everything I'll put my secondary clutch back on with stock spring and helix. And do some more testing, might be a few days.
I'm running the oem belt, with your white spacer in primary.
I have the alignment tool and have checked it. The alignment is perfect.
I do have a hunterworks belt I'll throw on at some point and see if it makes a difference, I've had it one before and didn't see any temp difference.

This is a starting point and a troubleshooting point, not necessarily what you will end up with. Now quit talking to anyone else about your clutch, listen to me and let me screw you up by myself then move to the next guy!!! LOL Truthfully the frustrating part is what you are doing, you got a problem you want fixed and asking too many folks. Doing what we do for 18 years and now over 28,000 belt sold we have had contact with a lot of folks with clutch issues and I have found out that there is not many clutch folks that actually know what they are doing and actually have good products. You see it over and over here from same companies and form opinions. FYI, mine is an opinion but based on what I get fed here.

 

[Slowgeneral]

I do appreciate the help! been out of the sxs game since my 2012 rzr S 800... so its been awhile.
Put the clutches back to there stock from, went to the lake to test- lake is about 1.3 miles across. covered in snow that changes on the daily, last week it was 4" of wet soft snow, now its colder and its turning into concrete.
anyway with clutches 100% stock its about 8900 rpm during shift, ran across and back at wot belt temp got to 200, but that's over 2 miles of solid WOT with a hot tune.
took the tune off and tried it, ran at 8k during shift. i forgot how much the machine is governed stock, basicly rode the speed limiter the whole test. belt was a little cooler.
also on one of these tests my gauge cluster went out for a brief second, not sure what that's all about. im sure it will come back to haunt me at a later date.
last test i remembered to write the results down was SLP weights at 68 grams, stock is 67. stock primary spring tied secondary with 52 straight helix. and the AA tune.
8k across the lake, about 190 belt temp after several runs, so it still climbs but slow enough that it wouldn't overheat the belt just running down the trails. Im sure the ol General loves me after holding WOT for miles and miles of snow covered lake testing.if it doesn't i know all the people who live on that lake do!
Definitely need more testing, but finally at the point where I can confidently screw up, or fix this clutching issue, Did confirm i can now pull the clutch cover, belt and swap secondary faster than i can fill the gas tank with one of those fancy obama approved gas cans.

 

[Slowgeneral]

Belt has about 50 miles on it, temp was around 170 when this happened. The white spacer had About 100 miles on it, notice how much grooving it has compared to a new one.
There's more issues going on and I'm 100% over it. At this rate I could just buy a duraclutch and be saving money. And a ton of time!
The only time I had consistently lower belt temps was really because it was -5 outside.